VS 
Two Malaysian blog advertising networks Nuffnang, and Advertlets recently launched within a month of each other, and I just had the privilege of interviewing the founders of both projects.
The main purpose of this interview would be to give a voice to these two companies on how they would compete in the local blog advertising market and the role they would play in it. Personally, I feel there is enough room for both parties to succeed and grow the blog advertising market - which also means more business for all of us. For this reason, I wish both of them great success in their ventures.
This is the longest post ever on this blog, so a suggestion to my good readers would be to zoom down to the questions which interest you, and maybe read the rest in a separate sitting :)
Due to the potentially loaded nature of this post, let me disclose a few things. I know both founders personally and I wish to keep a neutral stance here. Identical questions were sent to them via email, and were replied directly to me, with neither party seeing each others anwers prior to this post. I am quoting their replies directly, so this is not a 3 way conversation. All opinions expressed below represent their views and not my own.
How do you compete with Google Adsense? Their ads are contextual, allow specific site advertising - and they will cater all types of blogs. What’s your edge over them from a bloggers point of view, and from an advertisers?
Nuffnang says: In the case of bloggers, I would not compare ourselves to Google Adsense or see them as a competitor since many blogs (including many whom have joined us today) use Nuffnang Ads as a complement with Google Adsense.
In addition to that, we are also targeting a rather different market. Contextual ads work very well for tech blogs, automobile blogs, or blogs that are of a specific category since certain keywords pay very well. They don’t work so well for personal/lifestyle blogs that write about various topics but that does not mean that the traffic personal/lifestyle blogs have are of no value to advertisers. It just means that they need a rather different targeting method to bring the best out of its audience. That’s what Nuffnang is aiming for.
Now lets talk about advertisers.
To be honest, if I were an advertiser of an online business myself, it will be very hard for me to ignore advertising on Google Adwords which explains why most of the online advertising expenditure to date is spent on Google. That being said, Nuffnang offers an alternative that does not necessarily aim to act as a replacement, but more of a complement. If you are looking to tap the audience of the highly influential blogging community in Malaysia, come to Nuffnang.
Furthermore, because we are a local company, part of our job at Nuffnang is to educate and convince local advertisers that online advertising is just the way to go especially if you’re looking to the younger generation of today. Much of this generation are big spenders when it comes to mobile phones, cameras or computers but they don’t watch much TV anymore, nor do they read much of the daily newspaper. They do read blogs though… and if you want to reach them. You advertise on blogs.
Advertlets says: I’ll start by asking you how many local ads do you see anyway, on Google Adsense? Our competitor isn’t really Google Adsense – the Malaysian bloggers here who make a lot of money through Adsense, manage to make it because their content is skewed towards an international audience, mainly technology or gadgets.
What we offer is the chance for the bloggers to write local content and be matched with local advertisers, and for advertisers to be able to target and the right audience through blogs – using demographics and geolocation..
“Contextual†advertising has its logical limits – at some point, the audience has to tell you about them for it to be accurate. For example, let’s say you ran a blog that posted lots of hot, glamourous female celebrities - contextual advertising might match you with lingerie and clothing ads based on the keywords in the blog – but let’s face is, men like to look at women more than than women like to look at women. Demographic based advertising would make sure that the ads are targeted at the majority of the audience, in this example, it probably would be mostly men between the ages of 20-25.
Your rival blog advertising network has just launched - What is your competitive strategy against them? Why would bloggers/advertisers choose your over them?
Advertlets says: Our competitive strategy is simply, to kick more ass, from both a design and business standpoint.
We’ve run a poll on our own site, about the poll itself, and 35% of visitors said that they “love the way the poll slidesâ€. It sounds trivial at first, but then you realize – passionate bloggers love to customize their layout of their blogs, and put a lot of effort into the design. Of course it makes sense then that the advertising on their blogs should look and feel just as good. It reminds me of a quote by Steve Jobs from Apple, when asked to comment on Mac OS X’s Aqua user interface – he chose not to talk about the technology, but about the feel. Quote: “We made the buttons on the screen look so good you’ll want to lick themâ€
Wouldn’t you choose the blog advertising network that looked better on your blog, and extended its functionality? We also pride ourselves on being less intrusive visually – you’ll notice that our ads are way less intrusive than Nuffnang from a size, color, and font perspective. In the long run, we believe this will pay off, as it did for a certain search engine company that defied the rules of online advertising having to be “big and colourful to get attentionâ€, and decided to go with advertisements that were simpler, but smarter – hence more likely to get clicks. Good design is good business.
Of course, looks aside, we also have a much stronger network, reputation and establishment, based on our track record. Before we launched Advertlets.com, we were and still are a strong web design company (Josh Lim & Associates), which has done digital/online marketing & production for many local companies over the years, including : Pernod Ricard (Martell & Chivas), Proton Berhad, The Manhattan Fish Market (our current featured potential advertiser – we’re currently looking for qualified bloggers for a campaign, check out Advertlets.com for details), CIMB Group (CIMB Wealth Advisors & CIMB Principal), and more. Also, we have a fair share of non-local clients from Singapore, France, Hong Kong, Australia and the US.
We’re more media savvy too - Josh Lim & Associates has been featured in The Edge, The Star, R.A.G.E, CNet Asia, NTV7, 8TV, TV3, Astro Ria and more. We’ve marketed ourselves well as a company so far, and we also have other previous initiatives to prove it – the hugely popular RedesignMalaysia.com, an initiative that aims to improve broadband here which is ranked among the top 50,000 on Technorati. As of such, we’re pretty confident of marketing Advertlets.com, and making it worth it for everyone involved.
(You can read an interview with RedesignMalaysia.com which was previously featured on Friedbeef.com. ) Our competitor, Nuffnang’s idea of packaging all blogs, including blogs with “20 unique visits a day†who are “too small to stand on their own†together as an advertising package sounds good in theory. However, with an average click-through rate of 1-2% globally, this means that Nuffnang advertisers get a raw deal, and will be essentially, paying for a lot of blogs that bring little to zero returns.
For example, a blog with 20 unique visits a day, assuming a CTR of 1.5%, will only bring an average of 1 whole click, after 3 whole days…Their idea is commendable for the virtue of “wanting to help everyoneâ€, but virtually impossible from a business perspective.
In terms of business model, we at Advertlets.com have a good plan that allows both the targeting of established, high traffic blogs, and also advertising across the whole network, which includes other blogs with more moderate traffic. We have a minimum requirement of 100 visits a day, hence we have blogs with more visibility and higher participation rates – which translates to better click-through rates.
Currently, the average blog in our network has about 400-600 impressions a day. We will also be implementing a feature where users can set a premium on their advertising rates not just based on their traffic alone, but also the audience niche that they have.
Nuffnang says: Competition is good for the blogosphere and we welcome it.
We ‘re not out to make comparisons and give reasons for bloggers/advertisers to choose us instead of Advertlets. Instead, we would rather keep our eyes on the ball in making sure we bring the benefits that both advertisers and bloggers look for in a community like ours. Our bloggers have placed their hopes on us… we are not about to disappoint them.
Yet as much as we believe in this philosophy of concentrating on what we do, Advertlets have come up with a table of comparison between itself and Nuffnang linked from the main page of its website hoping to persuade both bloggers and advertisers that Advertlets is a better option. As much as we accept their decision for going down such a route, many things in the comparison are certainly not true and very misleading.
For example, Advertlets claim on their comparison table that Nuffnang does not have a user login. Yet we’ve been getting many e-mails from bloggers about how much they love to login to view our Analytics page where we can show not only the Unique Visits and Page Views that each blog gets but also the referrals, the countries of origin and even the search engine Keywords.
They also claim on their table of comparisons that we do not offer targeted advertising which is again misguiding since we obviously do targeting the same way they do it ie through a survey.
That being said, the most important thing both bloggers and advertisers should note is that at Nuffnang, we’re a community and rightfully so. We have brought in bloggers in certain talent pools to help us out and given them a share of the company. All the people behind Nuffnang including the very team of programmers that founded it have a direct or indirect stake in the company. Up till today, we are still looking for bloggers who have specific skill sets to come in and own a part of Nuffnang.
What other new features are you looking to add to this service to give it an extra edge over the rest?
Nuffnang says: You’ll just have to wait to see! Hold your breath folks.
Some features will be brand new and others will not. But as we work closer with the industry and bloggers and understand their needs, we will adopt features that fit their requirements.
Advertlets says: We will also be rolling out new features including:
- A desktop widget where you can monitor your blog statistics right from your desktop!
- More blog widgets: Music players, photo viewers, mailing lists, etc. If you thought the poll system was cool, wait till you see the rest.- Ability to cash out your earnings via mobile prepaid reloads. Of course you can always request cash/cheque, but for our bloggers on prepaid, we feel this is a unique and convenient solution.
- And also, the ability to take part in contests, polls, and win monthly prizes from our advertisers.
- An “auto-SEO†and blog aggregation function, which basically means if you join our network, your site also get better search engine results, and better site rankings. We can’t disclose how we will do this yet – but it’s all white hat SEO techniques, not to worry.
However, some of these features will be only for those who belong exclusively on our network. We define exclusive by “not being signed up to other Asian blog advertising networksâ€. Taking part in international programs such as Adsense, Payperpost, etc, will not disqualify you from being an exclusive Advertlets member.
Anything else you’d like to tell our readers?
Advertlets says: Joining us means you can find out more about your blog readers through the demographics poll, and we also offer a referral program for qualified bloggers. And through the Advertlets Philanthropy program, we and the rest of our members can help deserving causes through both financial and publicity means, including those who need financial/medical aid, charities, and the local creative scene (local bands & artists).
Lastly, you can read the competitor comparision chart on Advertlets.com
Bloggers and their audiences are far from just being just a niche crowd, and we are looking forward to working together with everyone to take this innovative advertising medium further!
Nuffnang says: To the bloggers at Nuffnang, thank you very much for your support. Whatever success we have achieved so far is only because of this special group of people that have put their trust in us. Each and every one of us can never be more grateful. Thank you.
March 16th, 2007 at 8:20 pm
Does Advertlets has any future plans to charge advertisers by the clicks they are getting (conversion) instead of just charging by impressions?
What are the types of advertising options being offered by Advertlets? (I know Nuffnang offers banners).
Thanks!
March 16th, 2007 at 8:31 pm
Great post.
Wait and see these two company progress.
March 17th, 2007 at 12:14 am
Great post.
Judging by the information from this interview, Advertlets sounds more promising. I hope both of them do well and benefit the local blogsphere, especially for those who blogs about local/regional topics.
March 17th, 2007 at 1:12 am
it’s just amazing the amount of rubbish josh lim can come up being well known as a NATO person (No Action Talk Only). Look at his current website for example, he takes so much pride on his ad unit and on his website design but log into advertlets and you will see the most incomplete and terrible looking interface. bloggers can’t even tell how many impressions they have today or yesterday, all we have is a counter to count the total ad impressions, clicks, ctr and polls done since the date we joined. i can’t even tell the number of visits i have today or yesterday or last week. that’s worse than the websites i have seen in the 90s. how can he even think of doing all those other features when he has the worst login i have ever seen. i can’t believe i actually fell for his tricks into joining him. i will be surprised if even half the things he preaches come true.
nuffnang on the other hand is a wild card. they are hardly doing anything revolutionary with their ad units or website even but for some reason seem to have the support of the malaysian blog scene. yet i think they’re too submissive. look at timothy’s answers, he didn’t even make an effort to convince people to join nuffnang instead of advertlets.
March 17th, 2007 at 1:15 am
James, great job! I learnt so much from this post. All the questions I have but not sure how to phrase it are answered here. Personally, I have only signed up with one and not the other. ‘Cos heh, I have no more space on my sidebar. But for someone who is earning a decent income in USD from my blogs, I will support the one which gives me a better ‘feel good’ factor than the $$ they promise. Once again, thanks and it was a pleasure to meet and sit with you at the same table during the gathering. Me gonna add you to my link soon so that I can continue with your great blog!
March 17th, 2007 at 2:04 am
Great work James, I’m gonna featured this in my blog, but let me sleep now :P Crazy day.
March 17th, 2007 at 2:20 am
Interesting comments by all. As the “other half” of the Nuffnang community, I would like to add my own perspective, if I may.
We at Nuffnang know our strengths. But we do not believe that the one who blows his trumpet the loudest is necessarily the best. We are self assured that we will perform, because we have to.
Why? Because soo many bloggers have put their faith in us.
We have the capacity to add any amount of function to the website you can imagine. Believe me. There are few boundaries in the world of programming (I have learnt).
We also have the capacity to throw out all our corporate credentials, and drop names, valid or invalid.
However,getting the basics and essence right is what matters most to us.
1) Community Building- Bringing bloggers and bloggers closer, and advertisers and bloggers closer.
This aim could not be achieved if there was open conflict caused by a shouting war.
2)Delivering on our promises- Namely to increase the profile of blog advertising, to make blogers money, and to give advertisers a credible and effective platform.
Actions speak louder than words, and that is why my partner has decided to take what we naively think is the “dignified” path out.
It has worked so far, and our supporters have been so kind. We can only thank them, and be grateful. And deliver.
March 17th, 2007 at 2:39 am
cool stuff here. no wonder my firefox script controller keep reporting these two advertising network. so this is all about. man im totally newbie. thanks for this info. im glad im one of yer email feeds subscriber. this definitely will end up in my blog. great stuff here. but like hongkiat said, let me sleep first! ;)
March 17th, 2007 at 3:06 am
Hmm.. Interesting. I din know that there was another local online advertising company coming up. Looks like Nuffnang is on the lead!
March 17th, 2007 at 9:48 am
Great Post!!
Speaking from an Ads publishers point of view, I am only interested to make the most out of the most. I signs up with almost every Advertising NetWork there is, just to see which one brings me the most revenue. Thus both Advertlets and Nuffnang appears in my blogs.
My impression is the competition comes from getting the best paying Advertisers into their network, and Advertisers will only come aboard if they see the real time statistics of how many people are going to view their Ads. and of course actually click on their Ads.
So I think the actual competition starts with the recruitment of bloggers into their fold. The more bloggers they have in their network, the higher the figures they will have to show to the Advertisers.
March 17th, 2007 at 3:14 pm
Josh Lim will be replying personally to some of the issues raised here, but in the meantime, here are some quick answers:
reallybites: Yes. We offer sidebar advertising, sponsored posts, sponsored polls, and video ads.
infinity: Have you filled in your details completely? Full site statistics are not available until your details are filled in, and your account is approved.
Please e-mail info@advertlets.com if you have any further questions.
Advertlets.com Support
March 17th, 2007 at 4:50 pm
great interview! thanks!
March 17th, 2007 at 7:16 pm
Lilian: Yeah definitely great to meet you too… and I’m sure many people would appreciate the ‘lack of space on sidebar’ issue as well :)
Ahpek: Agree. Media buyers will only start to care if the number of readers are large enough. I really hope most bloggers would choose BOTH the networks so the effort to reach a critical mass is not split in two.
ps. Thanks for everyone who dropped a comment here, let’s drive the market forward together!
March 17th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
I’ve met the three masterminds behind these two advert companies during the bloggers meet. it was nice to know them and be able to share my views with them personally.
However, I think it will come down to how much an advertising company is willing to give out to bloggers. features are cool, but they are after all, optional.
reliability, uptime and speed is an issue for nuffnang for now, and advertlets need to refine their code and not conflict with the blog’s template..
neitherless, a little blog ad war is fun, but please don’t take it too far.
March 17th, 2007 at 8:17 pm
woops, forgot to add a few more stuffs.
advertlets interface is nice, but not properly designed. after logging in, try moving around to another page, and you find yourself unable to find the control panel again, thus needing you to login again. (without pressing the back button.)
Other than that, there’s not much stats to view, but just as josh commented on my blog about advertlets, their stats and demograpics are their main selling point.
nuffnang’s interface not as pretty as advertlets but it works better than advertlets. However, query time is slow - because they started off with 1 dedicated server to now 2 dedicated, yet it’s still slow. stats and all that are good, but there’s still room for improvement.
another 2 cents from me. :)
March 17th, 2007 at 10:12 pm
Well done, dude!
Whatever comes out of this duel, I think both Advertlets and NuffNang are good for development of the Malaysian blogosphere.
March 17th, 2007 at 10:45 pm
cincau: actually we just made some changes to the way we handle queries so it should be much faster now. try it out and see… if you still think its slow please do feel free to e-mail me…
March 18th, 2007 at 2:17 am
boss stewie: it’s better now compared to yesterday. way faster. :) good job!
March 18th, 2007 at 4:46 am
Some hostility there, hahaha, a bit of competition is good. I’m a great believer in free market lol.
March 18th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
I met Timothy during the party, he was a friendly and cheerful person, he explained his nuffnang program well which I signup that nite.
On the other hand, I never seen the other part approached me. maybe I am toooo small blogger to grab their attention?
Anyway I like the nufffnang’s idea of making this a community that we could somehow comeout and chat together in face. thats the erason I was in the party.
March 19th, 2007 at 12:53 pm
Hey James,
Great Piece. For the longest time- i never thought of monitizing my site. With this post, I am VERY interested to do something!
It was my absolute pleasure to have MET you at the bloggers meet:)
Stay in touch,
KID
March 19th, 2007 at 3:12 pm
I like the interview. I believe there are strength from the each of the parties. At the end of the day, i would prefer a great affiliation between these two instead of competition.
March 19th, 2007 at 3:44 pm
Thanks. That was indeed a very informative post. I have visited both sites. Can’t wait to see them progress in their own way(s).
Ideally, I would think it is important for both companies to:
1. maintain website
2. update and highlight new features
3. bring in more freebies / contests
4. reach out more to the media
5. expand SEA and then globally (I’m sure it’s possible!)
Can’t wait. Keep it up!
March 19th, 2007 at 3:44 pm
I’m all for Nuffnang cos for one thing, I’m a personal blogger. I blog not to make money, but to keep in touch with friends and make new ones. So Advertlets is really not going my way. Besides, Nuffnang is community based advertising! I like that word. Community!
March 19th, 2007 at 5:16 pm
you have been tagged: 6 weird things about me
March 19th, 2007 at 7:12 pm
so thats how you got so many viewers… great piece of post here.. :)
March 19th, 2007 at 7:24 pm
infinity: I believe Advertlets Support has addressed your comments. Please fill in your details completely to view full stats.
CincauHangus: Code bug fixed. We’ve posted the announcement on own main page.
Ming: I don’t need to address your comments on my corporate credentials being valid or invalid. People can Google “Josh Lim” and decide for themselves. Also, we’ve made 1 amendment to the chart, which was an oversight on our part.
Essentially though, you have acknowledged that the rest of our comparision chart is absolutely true. :)
kimfluttersby: Yes, Miss Kim, we will do all/are in the process of doing those things! We already have signups from Hong Kong, Macau, India, Phillipines & Singapore so far btw.
Thanks to our supporters, and all those who’ve given constructive criticism. We will continue to kick ass, in dramatically increasing levels!
Before we start slowing down from the heavy traffic (our web host is screaming!), we will be shifting to a dedicated server before the end of the month.
Also, we’ll be rolling out new features throughout this week - and paying opportunities by *this week*. Stay tuned!
March 19th, 2007 at 8:08 pm
Kidchan: Dear person who owns star.com.my… and grabs tons of type-in traffic meant for thestar.com.my. you SURE you never thought of monetizing websites? haha
Thanks for the input Splashmilk, Kim, Mae and Shireen.
Josh, Boss Stewie and Ming: Keep on going!
March 19th, 2007 at 8:38 pm
Here’s a good Google Query Josh
deleted *You can critique either service, but no personal attacks please* - admin
March 19th, 2007 at 11:17 pm
James: I was referring to my personal site ler:)Btw, you really read minds ahhaah
March 20th, 2007 at 10:27 am
hahaha, getting interesting. :)
This is really great, James.
p/s: can i call u uncle James? blek~
March 20th, 2007 at 11:43 am
Sure thing Auntie Cely ;P
March 20th, 2007 at 1:59 pm
Someone has been mounting a massive DDOS attack on Advertlets.com. You are free to show support, but resorting to unethical behaviour like DDOS and personal attacks is very distasteful.
March 20th, 2007 at 4:16 pm
wow, my inbox just beep me on this comment. Who did this? Come on guys. They both our friends. no need to do all this! Sorry to hear this Josh. Get their IP or something. Let them be ban!
March 24th, 2007 at 12:03 pm
Thanks, papajoneh. We managed to block the culprit, hopefully he will behave from now on.
In happier news - an update on Advertlets : we now can narrow down who are Malaysian visitors (from all ISPs - whether TMNet, Jaring, Maxis, etc). Advertisers can choose to ONLY advertise to Malaysians, or only TM Net users, for instance.
Also, we’re giving away RM15,000 to 300 bloggers! That’s RM50 per blogger for you to review Advertlets on your blog. Why? Because we want to reward our users, and we’re putting our money where our mouth is :)
April 5th, 2007 at 11:03 pm
Thank you, borrow your nuffnang logo
http://bosslepton.blogspot.com/2007/04/nuffnang-vs-advertlets.html
April 7th, 2007 at 10:17 pm
James or any visitors of this site, if you are interested in media business, consider to start a clone of techcrunch.com for Asia Pacific. Asia Pacific Internet startups can really use a dedicated PR platform. Most of startups are cash-strapped and/or not media savvy. They certainly appreciate a helping hand in publicity. Besides publicity, entrepreneurs and wannabes can hang around the site to learn from each other. What is it for you? You can follow revenue model of techcrunch.com, e.g. ads, sponsorships. Basically such site is essential component to create a vibrant entrepreneuring community besides universities and funding sources.
April 8th, 2007 at 2:05 am
Encik Wan - Thanks for the comment. We would if we could be the next Tech Crunch. The sad thing is - not many innovations in AsiaPac are meant for the international market. Even these two companies are Malaysian centric at the moment. Innovation is by far, not concentrated in comparison to the Bay Area in America for example, which makes it hard. Thanks for your kind input anyway, and with your support, this site will hopefully become many a launching point for many a company.
April 10th, 2007 at 5:52 pm
see this funny site that talks about it http://script-of-your-life.blogspot.com/2007/04/nuffnagees-vs-adverletser-whichever.html#links
April 10th, 2007 at 6:33 pm
I have here a comment from Hanson Toh: Google Country representative for Malaysia which was emailed to me when I asked him about his opinion on Nuffnang and Advertlets
“…they’re obviously good companies, all recognising the potential of online advertising. I think the main concern we all share is that we’re all working together to grow the pie - referring to the pool of online advertiser, and in that sense, I don’t think we compete but rather we all draw attention to the common goal.”
July 21st, 2007 at 2:59 pm
Nice info.
August 3rd, 2007 at 5:39 pm
Good news for malaysian blogger. Will it be available for indonesian like me?
August 3rd, 2007 at 5:43 pm
Nice tech site. Would you like to exchange link? If interested, contact me by leaving a comment here http://tech-gadget-id.blogspot.com
October 29th, 2007 at 6:52 am
syabas! it is really nice to see malaysian involves in the world of blogging and as well as online advertising. I have been waiting so long for this to happen and now we got 2 advertisers! so, as a malaysian, you guys have my support. both of your ads will be in my site.thanks
November 3rd, 2007 at 1:20 pm
hey guys, do you realised this problem where advertlets is slowing down your blog?
Try entering my joke collection blog
http://www.lawakjoke.blogspot.com/
once adverlets is completed loaded, everything appears
November 12th, 2007 at 4:04 pm
Nice…
December 12th, 2007 at 5:35 pm
Tried both.Advertlets pays like crap and has non existent support.Nuffnang is so much more better.
December 28th, 2007 at 6:39 am
I have both on my blog. Ehm looks like 1 is better than the other?
January 3rd, 2008 at 1:49 pm
Advertlets totally sucks. Josh is a bodoh totally. I had an account and I got 300+ last time but they didnt reply me yet, they just hanged my account. Their customer care service is worlds amazing customer care service. Shame of Advertlets. Go to hell. I love Nuffnang, they talk less and do above my expectations. I love it.
January 3rd, 2008 at 1:50 pm
Go to hell advertlets and stop your stupid company.
March 16th, 2008 at 10:33 am
I dropped both Nuffnang and Advertlets and stay with Adsense… Any other better alternative for me???
April 9th, 2008 at 11:55 am
Grad My Ads?
May 9th, 2008 at 5:32 pm
Advertlets Sucks big time here is the full story >> http://www.webmastermalaysia.com/revenue-monetization/12060-adverlets-com-does-not-pay-publisher-since-august-07-a-3.html
May 16th, 2008 at 12:22 am
I stopped using both. I noticed there are more female bloggers on those two advertising networks. Most of them gets really famous quickly simply because they are pretty. When you have the looks and all the blog readers wants to be your friends.
September 17th, 2008 at 6:35 pm
Thanks for sharing!